I think I'd just re-evaluate the friendship with such a shrewish person. I can accept my friends, with whatever attributes they have, and still have a personal standard for myself that differs from theirs. I am not judging them, I am purposefully not judging them, they can live their lives, for the most part, however they want and it has fuck all to do with me; I am judging myself, and I am policing my own behavior.
This reminds me of someone my friend told me about who was informed that she is objectively overweight
Are you still objectively overweight if you like your weight and everyone you know says you look good?
People just... check out of reality mentally when they really want to believe something that absolves them of responsibility for their own position in life, I am realizing.
If someone feels ok being obese and doesn’t want to change - you can still be their friend and support them. That doesn’t stop you from saying “I don’t feel good at this weight and I want to change”
The FA/HAES movement is shockingly good at arguing that everybody has a different body, and bigger bodies can feel completely comfortable being bigger; while completely denying that everybody has different body, and some people legitimately hurt or feel sick when they get above a certain weight. Which is hypocritical, and no one is surprised but them.
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Not everything is about you, Karen
Iceberg is a good analogy. Your gf might wanna steer clear.
“Please re-evaluate you friendship if your fat friend doesn’t accept you being less fat than her. And talks about unhealthy foods or gaining weight in front of you. When she knows you are trying to lose weight.”
Yes, when I mention needing to practice drawing or coding, i'm clearly just shaming you for not knowing how to draw/code. And when I mention my japanese is getting really rusty, I'm attacking you for not knowing Japanese. Apparently we must all be exactly 100% the same, except you. You get to be perfect. We're clearly just cheating you out of your rightful worship.
Seriously. Tf. I'm me. Go be you somewhere else.
"Fat people have a right to exist!"
re-evaluate your entire fucking existence if you are in the process of losing weight
Can you imagine being so self-obsessed that you twist your friends' personal choices into attacks on you?
I accept, appreciate and encourage my friends with no education beyond a high school diploma to do the best with what they have, and I’m still allowed to be anxious and plan for a master’s degree.
I accept, appreciate and encourage my friends who are child-free in their choices and priorities, and I’m still allowed to want children and be anxious about when I can finally start the adoption process.
I accept, appreciate and encourage my overweight and obese friends to be their best selves and do the best with what they have, and I’m still allowed to want to lose weight and try to lose weight
Everyone has different priorities, and that’s okay. I can accept people have priorities above healthy weight and exercise and sensible eating. I don’t know what other problems or stressors they are dealing with. I’m not about to dictate another person’s life.
I’m not going to pretend that their size and eating habits and activity levels are anything but what they are, but I’m not rubbing in their face either.
I’m a considerate, empathetic human being, but I am not a liar.
Well, I do hold myself to higher standards than I hold those around me. I often fail to meet them, but if I do not at least try, then I stand no chance of ever meeting them.
I had a friend in college when I was a huge fat guy who used to tell me "life is like a box of chocolates, it doesn't last long for fat people". I like my honest friends.
If my fat friend told me she wanted to lose weight, I would offer to help her. Coddling her by stroking her hair and telling her she's pretty isn't going to make her feel good about herself. Doing something good for herself, by herself, will make her feel good about herself.
Fine. I'll really evaluate a friendship with somebody who would be so selfish to begrudge me my own hang ups.
I can accept my fat friends and want them to feel good about themselves while acknowledging we all could stand to lose some weight.
Why does accepting someone and wanting them to feel good have to mean pretending they have no flaws? Why do FA people expect you to treat your fat friends like the only perfect people on earth?
This is just so cringe!!!
But I forgot my health revolves around people that “feel bad about themselves”
Blokity block blocky block blockity block. Or just leave fb cuz it sucks anyway.
Your entire existence should be wrapped up in how good your friend feels about her body, while entirely discounting how you yourself feel about your body. Right.
I guess I should stop talking about how pissed I am I didn't get As in all my classes this semester just because my friend is struggling for a C.
Girl bye 👋
I wish my existence involved fucking... also, what I think about myself has nothing to do with you, because I usually don't think of you that much.
Well... depends on the way you say it I guess? Like, I'll definitely talk about how I dream of having a toned stomach one day (2019 goal) but I'm not going to rant about how much I hate that ugly remaining belly flub I have. I'm open about the fact that I'm working on weight loss, but I try to avoid being negative about it.
On the other hand, thankfully my two closest friends have always been skinnier than me so I feel completely free to be blunt with my exact thoughts with them.
Last time I've encountered something like this was in elementary school, when annoyingly rich annoying classmate was whining about the colour of the horse she got for her birthday. I taught to myself, bitch, my mom won't even let me keep goldfish, fuck you and your miscoloured pony.
Then I grew up.
Love my lactose intolerant friend to bits, we hang out, she orders tea, I order a latte, we never talk about lactose intolerancy, she never feels slighted or mocked, because we're adults. Summer? No problem, I eat ice cream, she eats sorbet. No need to reevaluate anyone's existence.
If anything clothes for skinny people should be cheaper. I'm sorry but an XL shirt is literally twice the fabric of an XS shirt?????
Virgie, stuff costs money. For all of us.
It's not the problem of clothing companies to cater to your imagined discrimination.
Why should I have to pay more money for clothing made of twice the amount of fabric of a size medium!? Similarly, I refuse to pay more for two pizzas than one, that is clearly discrimination because I need two pizzas, I can't just live off of one pizza like some skinny twig bitch!
I pay less for clothes because I'm sized out of a lot of women's clothes and anything unisex (at 5'1" and not even particularly thin), so either I shop in the kids' section or I don't buy anything. Lucky me?
(This is why I get so annoyed by the claim that thin privilege means always being able to find clothes in your size. Yeah, right.)
I work in a restaurant and... it’s expensive to feed fat people. You require more food and more drinks to feel satisfied because your bar of “enough food” is set way to high. Your body requires more calories to maintain its size. Your body requires more fabric to cover the expanse of its volume. Your body takes up more space. This is a materials cost thing, not a discriminatory thing. You can’t go to lunch with someone who orders only an entree, compare their ticket cost with yours which contains an appetizer, beverage, entree with add-ons and maybe even a dessert, and cry discrimination cause your ticket is at least double the cost.
I pay a lot more for my clothes now than I did when obese... because now vanity sizing has sized me out (even at BMI 22!!) and I have to get everything tailored or imported from other nations unless I want to wear kid clothes.
Also I have always had to get my stuff hemmed because I'm short! Thing is I can't change my height now can I? Nor do I want to get fat again just for clothes to fit off the rack.
So instead of just bitching on the internet I got a sewing machine and remembered what my Grandma taught me and started fixing my own shit. Costs me time and money to do but that is just life.
Ugly Fucking Dresses, Sizes 000 to 50. Appropriate for Nuns At A Cocktail Party. $10,000 OBO.
Virgie stop complaining. Go out there and build your fat fashion empire! Nothing’s stopping you - except reality. You say fat women aren’t stupid and lazy. Prove it by getting off your ass and doing something.
Or shut up. No one else exists just to make you happy.
Maybe they could cut down on food? That would help their wallet in so many ways.
...that dress in the picture is $295 regardless of whether you get a 4XS or a 4XL.
So what exactly is she complaining about now?
*the XL is on a person with "56" bust, 44/46" waist, 65" hips" so a 4XL has to be around at 52" waist? While the XXS is a 33" bust, 23" waist, 33.5" hips. But they cost the same...and one has probably 4x the fabric.
In a nutshell:
"Pushing us out of the work force"? I think being bed-ridden due to a herniated disc will have taken care of that long before any discrimination.
But like she’s charging the same bullshit price for ALL sizes
Is Goop a company? What is Goop?
My brain imploded from all the buzzwords hear. I honestly can’t understand what’s being said
It's not like they have to use more material which makes it more expensive to make or anything
If anything, the smallest sizes are subsidizing the largest, because they all cost the same but it absolutely costs more to produce asize 40 dress than it does a size 00. Sounds like fat privilege to me!
In any case, those dresses are butt ugly, that whole brand is pricy, not Just Goopy Carbonara’s pandering collection (she’s made it her thing to be as skinny as possible, now she’s selling plus sized clothes? lol) and if you want cheap ass clothes go to FashionNova and call it a day.
So fat women should get a break on clothing prices because they face discrimination in the workforce.
African-American women typically earn less than white women. Should they get a discount? Maybe everybody who isn’t a straight WASPy cisgender nondisabled upper middle class male should get a discount. Distribute Oppression Points and apply accordingly.
But why would this logic apply only to clothes, Virgie? Where’s the outrage that fat people pay the same as skinny people for cat litter, bath towels, and felt-tip markers? Doesn’t their (allegedly) reduced earning power mean that there is a disparate impact in ANY purchase?
and another thing, if you're going to shop at an online store that has the audacity to charge $212 CDN for a fucking sports bra and $1,102 CDN for a viscose (cheap fabric) blazer - you're in no position to be complaining about finances.
didnt realize forbes got fucking virgie tovar on their payroll
Everything from Goop is insanely expensive, no matter what size it is. Complaining about the cost of plus sized clothing from Goop makes about as much sense as demanding that they offer a discount version of the jade egg so that us broke women can shove rocks in our coochies too.
It depends on the context of the post really. If they’re recovering from an eating disorder or something it’s perfectly fine to say this imo
I can’t think of a quicker and more effective way of derailing your relationships, your career and your health than by lying to yourself. Lying to yourself just disempowers you. If you don’t know the truth, you have no idea of what to do or how to do it. This is a suicide of the spirit.
Of course! I get it now. If you love someone, you lie to them!
This person is being honest about how they must lie to themselves in order to be happy.
It's very sad.
that is the definition of DENIAL! she is in denial about her weight :/
I just couldn’t do it. I was briefly entertaining the idea of trying to “love” my obese body when I was at my highest weight but I couldn’t lie to myself. It felt so disingenuous. Luckily I didn’t entertain that idea very long & decided to lose the weight so I could look in the mirror and ACTUALLY like my body again. I hope this person stops lying to themselves, too. Life is too short.
you know its profound when its italicized
No. This spring I thought that I’d gained 10lbs caring for my MIL, since she likes to eat out and as I was awake during lunch time I was eating one meal more than usual (my sleep schedule is split up because Crohn’s beastie thinks midnight/very early morning is the time to go the most). Fortunately, at a dr appt I found it was only 3lbs, turns out I have bloating issues. I cared very much about the 10lbs, not obsessively, but if you don’t care, then each increment of 10lbs comes along much more easily.
Fake it until you make it?
Although if they ever made it they wouldn't be in our faces constantly telling us how secure and happy they are in themselves.
At what point do you stop pretending you don't care? I mean, sure, 10 pounds isn't that much, but when you add another 10 pounds, and another, and another do you start caring then? Wouldn't it be better to care at a point where it's pretty easy to manage? Because there will come a point where lying to yourself no longer serves your interests.
Ethanol can be used as rocket fuel. Therefore I'm a rocket.
I love how, according to these people, the body, when low on energy, instead of using fat as an energy source will actually STORE more energy (that it doesn't have?) as fat. Brilliant.
People think they can link to any study , no matter how irrelevant, as a source for their outlandish claims. I guess they think most people won’t even bother reading it.
Best case: This guy found a cool experiment and now uses any flimsy excuse to bring it into conversations.
Worst case: Another person who doesn't actually read their studies and just tries to be right by linking to things that don't support their point or are of questionable quality.
Hydrogen sulfide is extremely toxic. So shutting down all metabolic processes highly likely.
Also, that sounds a whole lot like dying, but what do I know.
That mfer literally googled can humans hibernate and copy pasted the link there..
Seems to me like that person was overeating at meals and the little snacks stopped it. So he was just reducing calories overall and didnt realize it.
I think they just saw the word 'metabolic' and ran with it.
Sounds like he eats less because he was overeating because his satiety signals were out of whack, or he just didn't realize how much he was eating.
Doesn't feel as hungry when snacking, eats overall fewer calories.
If humans hibernated, we'd hear about it way more.
"Haven't seen Jim in a few months have you heard from him?"
"His wife said he's hibernating, she's gonna wake him up first week of March."
That would be terrifying for people who live alone.
How does everyone here find this stuff? I tried to join a couple of Fat Acceptance/HAES groups, but they demanded full body photos with my name written on a sheet of paper and a certain number of fingers held up, or something like that. I don’t have the energy or time to photoshop it.
Starvation mode is a real thing. It’s just not from literally dieting for a few months.
H2S is so fucking deadly. I’d like to see him hibernate. He’ll definitely hibernate the rest of his life I promise
The article he linked makes it clear he responded to that guys comment by searching "can humans hibernate" to validate his own bullshit.
digestive tract workout
Lol “one time someone poisoned someone into hibernation therefore humans hibernate”
Really, any eating strategy that works for you is fine. Six, seven meals a day, one meal a day, eating window, grazing, whatever. End of the day, energy balance is what matters. There is no need to make up bullshit about hibernation to justify a preference to graze.
TIL that snacking all day gives your digestive tract a constant workout.
Yeah, how’s that workin out for ya?
Serious question, why was the comment about snacking more and smaller meals downvoted? From everything I’ve read (maybe it’s because I’ve been pregnant and breastfeeding?) it says I should have three small meals with snacks in between instead of three big meals. I don’t know what nonsense is happening in the rest of this picture, but is that original comment (not the hibernate part) really that off?
My body warns me that it’s hungry. It has just come to terms with the fact that it won’t get fried chicken every time it cries.
Being ‘needle phobic’ and morbidly obese is not a workable combination.
Oh sweetie, putting “morbidly obese” in scare quotes doesn’t make it any less categorically true.
It feels like being 35, “morbidly obese,” and needle-phobic is the trifecta that medicine will not abide
If she were only 30 then there wouldn’t be any issue. Too bad she missed the mark by 5 years.
In all seriousness, this is embarrassing. This person is the most entitled person I’ve ever seen. She wants doctors to capitulate to her and make her feel good about her weight. The second a doctor brings up serious concerns and wants to perform tests, suddenly “Oh I’m afraid of needles, we can’t do that test,” and “Oh, I exercise and eat healthier than the Dalai Lama, so there is nothing wrong with being fat.” She sounds like a spoiled child.
Edit: Of course medicine will not abide. Medicine will not also abide the flu or HIV. Medicine should not abide horrible and destructive lifestyles.
I’d kind of like if my doctor asked me about my weight and if it’s normal for me or not. To be fair, I have a normal BMI, but especially when you have a new provider, I think it’s important for them to know if there’s been recent gain or loss.
The clinic I go to also does automatic diabetes blood screens for anyone over BMI 25. It’s not personal, they don’t care if you’re 1 lb over or 300, and why wouldn’t you want to know?
I've seen how changes in my exercise (more or less) has negligible impact on my size
No shit Sherlock, it's been well established that exercise isn't key to weight loss, while eating less is. It's basic thermodynamics, you take in more energy than you use, you'll store the excess and vice versa.
She eventually asks about how I eat. At that point I volunteer how much I exercise
Yeah, see above.
If I had trypanophobia, I might work on making the lifestyle changes necessary to avoid diabetes...seems like there are a lot of needles involved in that.
I'm sure this doctor will be utterly shattered if this patient takes her annual wellness check & bc renewal elsewhere.
I had to go to the doctor a couple months ago because I was extremely fatigued and getting unexplained bruises. One of the first things the doctor did was ask about my diet (despite my being a healthy BMI). If you have symptoms that could easily be caused by a poor diet—whether that be signs of iron deficiency in my case, or obesity in OPs case—your doctor is doing their job by asking about it. And yes, they clearly do ask any patient it’s relevant to about it, even if they’re a healthy weight.
I also had to get my blood drawn. Guess what? I’m extremely scared of needles. If I’m not too busy passing out I usually attract an extra nurse or two. I absolutely freak out and it’s no fun, and it doesn’t help that I have small and difficult veins.
That doesn’t change the fact that sometimes you need to get blood drawn and unless you’re a doctor you’re not qualified to say when that is or isn’t necessary. So when I went in a couple months ago and my doc said he’d like it if I got some blood drawn, I told the folks at the lab how I usually react. They had me wait an extra fifteen or so minutes to make sure that the guy who was good at getting difficult veins on the first try was free, they had me lay down, and they turned a fan on and had ice ready. My doctor was NOT in the wrong for making my health his first priority, and the lab handled the situation perfectly.
"triggered my needle phobia" . . . Does this person understand that when she goes to the doctor she is paying to be examined by a medical doctor?
An actual doctor of medicine who currently practices doesn’t have time to read some bullshit HAES blog you pass off as a “study”.
Also, people this fragile and whiny make me feel like fucking Rambo.
…that came out wrong.
…or did it?
"O" word? Its obese a bad word now?
Know who's afraid of needles, ever since childhood? Me. Squeamish, grossed-out, wanting my blood to stay in my body and foreign items to stay out of it. But, know who's diabetic? Also me. Multiple finger-pricks a day, insulin pump therapy that requires a thin needle to be always present under my skin, frequent injections, and lots of labwork including large blood draws. I had to get over myself reeeeally fucking quick when I got diagnosed.
When you value being alive, you learn to fucking suck it up. I have absolutely zero tolerance for this "needle-phobia" bullshit. Either she truly cares about living a healthy life, or she doesn't. There's no middle ground with this, and I think we all know where she stands (sits?).
You can't try to claim that you're so healthy and health-conscious and perfect, but at the same time deny medical professionals the ability to thoroughly examine you, based on a completely bullshit argument to boot.
Maybe I'm just having a trying day, but this makes me want to go punch something.
I’m not sensitive but just the mention of needles (at a doctors office) triggers me.
Good luck finding a doctor that would never put a needle on you!
My friend is very scared of needles. She also has a serious chronic illness that required her to get stuck with a lot of them. At a much younger age than this person, she learned how to cope with it (by asking not to be shown the needle) and let the doctors do what was necessary to keep her healthy. You can't help what you're scared of, but you can help how you deal with it and understand when it's necessary to overcome those fears.
Her previous doctors didn't give a flip about her health and only wanted her money, thus lied to her about her actual health and didn't raise any concerns about her weight.
"I don't consider myself sensitive about these things" "CW: THE O WORD"
THE O WORD LMAO
It takes a lot of nerve to curate journal articles for your doctor, who has 8+ years of academic training in the human body and is constantly staying up-to-date on the literature.
She eventually asks about how I eat. I cannot imagine this is how she'd talk to someone with a smaller body.
Uh, no. My doctor definitely asked me the exact same questions when I came in for my annual check up with BMI 16.8, compared to last year with a BMI of 19.1.
Never mind the fact that obesity reduces the effectiveness of birth control, and it would be negligent of a doctor to prescribe it to an obese person without inquiring about their weight and health habits first.
Being well over 35 and knowing lots of people my age and older, she's about at the age that your body stops letting you get away with treating it badly. But by all means carry on lady. Who the heck does your doctor think she is being concerned about your health.
Seems like the other 3 doctors just didnt gave a shit and when this one does this woman get offended .
"Morbidly obese" :facepalm: she said it herself , maybe she need to rethink what morbidly means...
Giiiiirl, I faint after I get blood drawn, but I still do it because blood tests are important to check your health. Also, just because your doc was unconcerned about an issue 5 years ago doesn’t mean that it couldn’t be a problem now. It could be that “mysterious” thing that is hindering your weight loss no matter how hard you work out.
I mean, I HATE blood draws and don't go through them very well (I essentially pass out, and it takes them forever to get any blood from me), but even I still suck it up and get it done. Good grief.
Translation: "Don't worry doc, i'm just waiting to die"
I'm needle-phobic, too. I always need to lie down when they draw my blood because I tend to get dizzy or even pass out. So I can somewhat relate to her. But to me my health is more important than my feelings so when the doctor says I should get some blood drawn, I just submit and try not to kick them.
Thankfully apart from that one allergy test, one other blood draw and my yearly flu shot (working against my needle phobia and protecting myself from the flu, talk about two birds one stone), the doctors never want to draw my blood, I just look too healthy.
Fun fact: You have to stay conscious during a blood donation, so even if I were willing, I wouldn't be allowed to donate blood since I pass out from stuff like that.
The ultrasound finding was probably fatty liver. Caused by being obese. The reason the doctor wants to draw blood is because it can lead to cirrhosis.
I'm sure other people have mentioned it but I'm not overweight and my doctor always asks me what my diet is and how much I drink every time I see her. As far as the weight questions, it's to make sure everything is normal for you, since sudden weight gain or loss are red flags.
And honestly, if my doctor was suddenly concerned about something on a chart that no one before had been concerned about? I would also be concerned and at the very least get a second opinion on it. Doctors aren't magical gods, sometimes they don't care about the patients and or they miss things. My grandma died from breast cancer partly because the doctor she went to found something suspicious and this information was not given to her in time. A less extreme example, I had a cavity that should have been taken care of a year ago but the dentist decided not to tell me anything and by the time I found out, it went from a small size to medium and I guess I should be glad that I changed dentists when I did.
She thinks "just going in to get birth control renewed" is a given. Like filling an order, not like actually going and having a checkup where they tell you what may be concerning. If it needs a prescription, it's not a given. People need to get all the way over themselves.
What stand out to me is how she sees a different doctor every year it seems. If these previous doctors were all for HAES or at least not focusing on her weight, why has she changed to a new one so regularly?
The "o" word.
I’m 5’6,” and 125lbs. When I switched to my current doctor, she absolutely asked if this was my normal weight and if I was happy with it. I think they’re used to seeing overweight people, that someone on the small side accidentally triggers alarm bells. Either way, I’m in the medical field, and know that my doctor is just trying to do her job.
The medical community doesn’t abide being 35? Are they even hearing themselves at all?
I hate people who trigger warn stupid shit. This is why no one takes trigger warnings seriously
It's sad how there's a parenthetical rage at her previous doctors not being concerned about her weight after the new one said she wouldn't be doing her job if she didn't make these suggestions.
Her previous doctors clearly did not do their job. She is still morbidly obese and has enough problems that, at 35, she needs to come in to see a doctor regularly and has for at least the past 3 years. Also, why is she going through so many damn doctors?
When I was younger I thought that all your medical problems started at 30. I had a completely different image of someone in their 30s than I do now. 35 is young. 35-year olds should be in the prime of their life, provided they don't have any serious injuries in their teens or 20s.
My mental image of 30-year olds was probably skewed by the fact that the majority of my family is overweight and now a growing number of them are obese.
this is so not the point but i love that being 35 was included in her list of things medicine simply won't abide sldfjsljksljghahahahaha. yeah doctors fucking HATE it when you're 35, drives them into a total rage. 34, no big deal, but once you hit 35? idk, i guess just like start getting your affairs in order...
The O word? I expected someone to orgasm in this text and was disappointed!
My doctors always ask my about my meals and snacks and exercise, and I'm 120 lbs. it's almost like they want to make sure everything is okay and you are healthy so you can feel better.
Sooo... you're 35. That means your fertility is dropping and your risks are going up, especially cervical cancer. An ultrasound could be something OBGYN related but since the patient had it when she was 30 there was probably a lower risk. Same with her liver. I'm sure she's had her liver enzymes checked before, her previous doctors probably didn't mention it then, but things change as you age. The doctor really would not be doing her job unless she asked all these "sensitive" questions.
Fat consequence is facing the consequences of a lifetime of bad choices and pretending like society is to blame.
So, she saw 4 different doctors in as many years, but only this one upset her? Why didn't she stay with the other ones then?
This disgusts me because it is insane. The doctor was being as nice as she could without sugarcoating the fact that she obviously has gained a lot of weight or she is obviously not in a good weight zone. Like what planet are these people on? My god get over it
Seriously why even go and see a Doctor if this is how you're going to behave? The arrogance of assuming you know better than somebody who has studied medicine and holds a medical license is astounding. If science and reason and everyone and everything is triggering you and you are only going for birth control, condoms might be the way to go to spare you the trauma. You should probably also never interact with anyone ever because you are bound to be offended.
Ugh give me a break. There are stroke risks associated with the pill. The doctor would be negligent not to do a full check up and weight factors into that prescription. Blood tests are for your own good. Doctors aren't there to get inside your head and trigger you.
The medical system is not the problem here.
Seriously? She put a LEGITIMATE MEDICAL TERM in trigger warning? That’s so sad Alexa play Despacito
If the girl changes doctor every year, I'm not sure it's because they tell her what she wants to hear.
Also loled at "the o word", I mean if you don't want to hear it maybe you shouln't make it a reality in the first place.
How fat do you have to be for a doctor to actually say something? I was 225 at 5'10 at my highest. Never had a doctor mention it, and when I asked, I was told it was probably good to lose a few pounds but they weren't worried. Literally the only time a doctor has shown any concern over my health is when I've had slightly elevated blood pressure and triglycerides (yay for being an alcoholic in recovery who had a massive binge the night before a blood test that spiked literally everything). Even then, when I was obese with high triglycerides and liver enzymes and blood pressure, do you know what they said? Lets retest in 3-6 months and see if it's still an issue. Then suggested I take fish oil and asked about my diet. When I said I ate clean but was an alcoholic who ate way too much clean food when drunk, they didn't even push the issue other than to suggest I cut down on drinking.
If I can be clinically obese and ask about my weight, and get no real concern in response, I have to assume this woman is beyond obese and has other indicators of bad health.
Because your tumblr followers have better access to full versions of peer reviewed studies than a doctor.
I don't think of myself as particularly sensitive to these things.
You need to rethink that.
I guess this another one of those weird fads that people who claim "to have tried everything, but couldn't lose weight" will add to their to do list.
Red light makes your wallet lighter with this one weird trick! Doctors hate this!
Santa is fat and Rudolph guides his sleigh. Theory debunked.
I admit, I've never seen an overweight person on Mars.
This reminds me of a boss that I had several years ago. She was morbidly obese and tried literally everything to lose weight except CICO. She loved fads - "What do you know about bee pollen??" and things like that. She came into work one day with special headphones that she was supposed to put on her stomach and play music at a certain frequency (I think that's how it "worked"). She wasted so much money on crap like that, it was so silly! I could totally see her trying something like this!
Finally the answer to my prayers where do I sign up
How do they come up with this stuff?
The sad thing is this device has no studies. There are people who have great expereinces with it online, but that's not exactly peer-reviewed.
Can we please just study this thing and if it's crap we throw it under the bus?
I've seen this lately along with cryotherapy. One of my more gullible friends shared it on FB. They posted side by side pictures of this lady where she was at least 20 pounds lighter in one picture and said that a 15 min dip in this cryo chamber will tighten you up and remove cellulite. 🙄
They have one of these machines at my gym I can use for free, but have never wasted my time on because I'm A. A huge skeptic B. Not into wasting my time C. If it really worked, it would be far more widespread and well known.
Wash away fat cells?
Wait, I thought it was blue light that had an effect on adipocytes. See study here
But hey... studies shmudies... Let's make some money :D
"Wash away fat cells" reminds me of the scene in Grease where one character sings along with the TV 'Brush-a, brush-a, brush-a, brush-a with Ipana...' Like it should be a tagline in some retro cleanser commercial or something.
Nice, that's the power crisis solved, fuck fusion reactors, we'll just build people power plants.
Step 1: Offer people money for free liposuctions
Step 2: Don't feed them, causing them to go into starvation mode, which leads to weight gain
Step 3: Burn the fat that was gained out of nowhere, use the heat to generate steam, power a turbine & dynamo
Step 4: Profit
/s, obviously, but you never know
I guess someome flunked not only physics, but also chemistry and biology?
There are very very few illnesses or medications that actually affect our BMR. Very few. Thyroid meds are one group.
However there are a bunch of meds and illnesses that increase our appetite, make us lethargic, make portions look smaller, increase our appetite for sugar, etc.
Just because there's a medical reason that makes you want to overeat or slightly (about 10%) decreases your BMR doesn't mean thermodynamics stop applying. It's all still CICO.
It really bugs me when people list off medical reasons for why CICO isn't real without realising that everything they mention are just things that affect the calories out. They're not disproving anything, just giving reasons why some people have it harder
If you're gaining fifty plus pounds due to edema I would call your doctor because I'm pretty sure that's not at all normal.
Fire can't go through walls, stupid. It's not a ghost.
I mean sure, there are conditions we don’t really understand like ALS and several cancers. So yes, we don’t know absolutely everything about the body. Hormonal disorders like Cushing’s can be a bit of a shot in the dark treatment. Other ones, like hypothyroidism, we have a general understanding of how to treat. Autoimmune conditions can also be a challenge to diagnose at first because their symptoms could be several things. I doubt that’s what they’re referring to though
We have nailed the fact that CI > CO means there’s a net increase in the amount consumed. Therefore, you will gain weight. If the equation is CI < CO you will lose weight. Period. End of sentence. Nothing more to say.
there are medical conditions which impact the metabolic need for calories
I believe that condition is called umm being dead.
Otherwise we'd see plenty of folks surviving just fine in times of famine like the Holodomor.
Why is “hypothyroidism” in quotes? Also, it absolutely does have known causes. The most common one is Hashimoto’s disease, an autoimmune condition. It’s caused by your body mistaking your thyroid for foreign tissue and attacking it. We’ve known this for a long time. What on earth is this person talking about
TL;DR there's a genetic, progressive abnormal adipose condition called lipedema that mutates fat cells so normal thermodynamics cease to work on them.
There's only one condition that I know of that can cause someone to get overweight or if really unlucky obese/morbidly obese. I know because I was diagnosed with it and its called Lipedema (or Lipoedema in the EU).
It was discovered in the 40s by the mayo clinic but at that point it was really rare so never really studied and kind of lost in medical history until the past few years. We know hormonal events (pregnancy, puberty, menopause, IVF, extreme burnout levels of stress, HRP, etc) can make it progress. And of course it really wasn't till the 60s that we really started messing with hormones, feeding it to our animals, plastics containing estrogen like substances, etc so now with all the hormonal manipulation... it's a little more common.
What we think is happening is lymph fluid, from a weak or damaged lymph system, seeps into the affected fat cells and cause them to grow well beyond what a fat cell should before saying "I'm full!" and creating a new fat cell. Its estimated a fat cell can fill up to 5x its max size. When this happens the fat cell is mutated and it no longer operates like a normal fat cell. This includes responding to caloric deficit.
At a caloric deficit any unaffected fat cells react like they should and you can lose normal fat. However, it doesn't even scrape the surface of the lipedema fat. Near the point of diagnosis, after probably 10 years of trying to do it all right and eat less and move more (and trying every damned diet in the book) I got so frusterated that I even thought I was lying to myself about what I ate even though I kept a near obsessive journal of what I ate and would have mental breakdowns if I was forced to go out to eat (couldn't control what was in my food). I decided to go 3 months at 1,000 calories while making sure to burn about 500 calories according to my HRM. So a net of 500. At 315lbs the fat should have melted off me. The result, aside from feeling pretty grim and my 2 hour exercise sessions turning to "I'm lucky I spent 10 minutes on the treadmill w/o passing out" was a face, upper chest, upper back/shoulders, neck and face that looked rather anorexic. Everything else was HUGE. About that time I was finally diagnosed and could stop torturing myself.
Today I've had 43 liters of fat liposuctioned off (via a surgeon specialized in lipedema), hiked mountans, gone nuts in the gym, still undergoing intensive therapy for how the fat wrecked joints and ligaments and made muscles dysfunctional, and still eat at a slight deficit to make sure I'm never the cause of fat coming back on my body. Oh, and I turn 40 in a few days and am fucking terrified of menopause and all this shit starting all over again.
So the Matrix was based on sound science: humans really can be used as energy-supplying batteries because they output more energy than they consume.
You're aware there are still functions in and of the human body that we don't understand, right?
That we need food in excess of our TDEE to get fat isn't one of them though.
Odd how yellow text can work that hard to try to negate a simple fact; you can't create mass out of thin air. The body can't make itself fat.
I mean, to be fair, if left untreated, Prada-Willi Syndrome (sp?) will make you obese.
But only if untreated/unmanaged.
Yes there are medical conditions and medicines that can affect your appetite and the kinds of food that you crave; yes certain conditions can lower your BMI; yes genetics and hormones can determine where that fat is stored.
BUT at the end of the day CICO still determines whether or not you gain or lose weight. You either eat less or expend more energy. It’s a no brainer.
Sometimes it just seems as though people want something else to blame and they don’t want to take responsibility for what they do to themselves. “Because my thyroid” is the new “the devil made me do it”.
Imagine thinking that the laws of physics don't apply to you.
TIL: If you are adamant enough with an appeal to ignorance then anything you like becomes true.
When I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism and put on medication, they told me it was because the medication I was on suppressed my thyroid function. Once I went off the medication, I no longer needed thyroid meds because now my hypo is sub-clinical. I actually lost all my weight with subclinical, untreated hypothyroidism. Fuck all these excuses.
There are conditions which cause weight gain tho. It’s not creating calories out of thin air, but it can be lowering metabolism + making your body better at absorbing calories and turning them into fat. Hormones can also affect appetite. So yes, you would still have to eat enough food to gain weight, but certain conditions can make you gain weight on less food than other people, as well as make you more likely to eat that food.
So if you had these diseases and you stopped eating all together, you would lose weight. The problem is that losing weight can be much harder.
So I get both sides of the argument.
we're eyeballing plaques instead of fat
Because fat can't be a major component of arterial plaque or what
Which fundamental law of physics is broken when we reclassify a muscle? No person got obese off of water retention.
I'll desperate wait for the day mah brain gives my body the signals to transcend the rules of our universe
Okay so the doctor basically told her the risks and her options and this is fat-shaming? There is just no pleasing these people.
These chances are not 1 in 5000. That is just an absolute lie.
The chances of gestational diabetes, for instance, go from something like 2% to over >11% for extremely obese. Study link. Anyone who thinks 11% is no biggie is invited to ponder if they'd ever agree to play Russian roulette with a 9-chamber revolver.
And GDM is just one of the possible pregnancy complications. So no, these are neither trivial risk factors, nor are we talking about some ultra-rare prevalence, nor are these health problems trivial either.
My BMI is 41...is this fat shaming or are these realistic concerns?
They'd STILL be realistic concerns at BMI 30.
Regarding the reply: considering that we're talking about something that could affect their life as well as their potential kid's life, I'd think even 1/5000 odds of serious complications is still too high.
Alright, pack it up boys. Science is cancelled.
I hate when people respond to others' fertility issues with "I got pregnant no problem." Fuck off, lady. On behalf of all who struggle. Nobody with issues is helped by your humblebrag.
I’m sad for her. Her doctor is trying to help her avoid valid health concerns and she’s taking it as a personal attack. Yes the truth hurts but after that you need to pick up and try to help yourself.
Good luck finding someone who is more weight-neutral
Even setting aside all the other health risks (pre-eclampsia, gestational diabetes, c-section, infection, difficult labor, hospital stays, etc), let’s just look at the worst outcome of all, actual death of the baby. Typical newborn death rate is 2.4 deaths per 1000 babies for healthy-weight mothers vs. 5.8 deaths per 1000 babies for morbidly obese mothers. (source).
How can anybody think that’s an acceptable risk? “oh, chances are the baby still won’t die, so I won’t bother losing weight.” Risk of the baby actually dying is creeping up to the 1 in 170 range, you have the capability to lower it and you don’t? Imagine a field 170 feet wide and somebody is going to shoot a pistol at a random direction in that field - would you seriously send your child out to stand in that field and just say “oh, chances are he won’t get hit.” You have the chance to widen that field to ~400 feet - your child is going to stand out there and face a bullet and you have the power to widen that field - and you actually don’t bother?
And when you add in all the other risks, particularly the near-certain guarantee that the child will be born with excess body fat and will struggle with obesity all throughout childhood & adulthood, the risk approaches 100% that the child’s health willbe negatively affected, and its lifespan ultimately shortened, by the mother’s obesity.
It is so frickin’ selfish to do something so horrible to an innocent child who had no say at all in the matter.
That reminds me of "Vegas, baby" (I watched it on Netflix) about a fertility clinic that gives away a free cycle of IVF to a couple chosen based on their personal videos submitted to the contest.
I watched it and thought to myself those people tried everything to become pregnant, spend thousands of dollars on the pursuit... but most women were overweight.
The delusion is really strong. Nobody doubts being underweight has an impact on fertility, but the other end of the scale is absolutely inconsequential? Please. Especially as fat isn't just a passive mass that just sits there, it influences the body's hormone levels - and not in favor of easy conception.
A family member of mine is obese and didn’t even try to lose weight before conceiving and is now 8 weeks pregnant and has already been diagnosed with gestational diabetes, stroke level high blood pressure and will most likely get preeclampsia and ICP before it’s all said and done (history of both in her previous pregnancy). I feel terrible for her but it was so irresponsible of her to try to get pregnant with all these issues. It’s much easier to get things like blood pressure/sugar and weight under control BEFORE pregnancy instead of during. She doesn’t take her own health seriously, but now there’s another person involved being directly affected and it just sucks. Any mention of healthy diet and exercise offends her so I just have to listen to her complain about “genetics” and keep my mouth shut.
I’m pregnant right now, was a BMI of about 25 when i conceived.Physically I’m in much better shape than I was with my first child, but I’m still having a hard time. Back pain, fatigue, etc etcI can’t even imagine trying to carry a pregnancy with an extra 150 lbs to haul. I can’t imagine trying to Labor with that kind of inherent physical limitation. It just seems impossible.
I agree that everything around pregnancy is made excessively scary for some reason: “don’t eat deli meat! Listeria!” When in actually the last few major outbreaks of listeria was on produce. There really is a lot of black and white fear mongering
That said. The women I see preaching HAES on Facebook are almost always the same group I see complaining about fertility issues.
Glancing at a BMI chart, it sounds like she's 5'7" and around 265 pounds. That's BEFORE getting pregnant and putting on pregnancy weight plus all the "hee hee hee, I'm eating for two hee hee hee" weight. She'll most likely put on at least 30 pounds, she's going to be pushing 300 when she delivers. I'm not sure how they calculate your BMI while pregnant but 300 pounds at her height is a BMI of 47. And assuming she won't drop back down to her pre-pregnancy weight (not likely if she's already struggling with weight) she may well be close to 300 pounds post baby. Does she even consider any of this?
Personally I never understand women and this "I'm bored, I want a baby, circumstances be damned" mentality. If you're already struggling with all kinds of problems (bad relationship/mental health/weight/finances/etc) why assume adding children will make any of that easier?
If you're that overweight with high blood pressure, it will negatively affect the fetus and may cause issues with the baby that will be life long. She's just thinking about herself and not at all about the future of the life she's wanting to bring to the world.
1/10000 is better than 2/10000, especially when 1/10000 is fully achievable.
Not taking care of yourself is one thing, but risking the health of your child and ignoring obvious warnings from a professional is just plain stupid. It makes me sad.
It’s not 2 in 10000, in 1 in 5000, I’d say that’s a pretty big difference
Why do people need to get on the internet and ask, "I just had an experience, can someone please tell me how to feel about it?"
Like if you left the office not pissed off, don't go seeking reasons to get pissed off. Just go on with your day. Every second of the day you don't get outraged is a fucking victory. Embrace it.
Why do they always say you can "fire" your doctor? That's not how it works, is it?
bit of anecdata
And that was when the blood started to shoot out of my eyes.
I've seen healthy, fit people on clinical rotations who are in the early stages of heart failure late in their pregnancies. It's not an easy process on anybody.
The truth is that there is nothing easy about parenting. Being unwilling to put in the work to have a healthy pregnancy does not bode well for a future child. This woman should lose weight. She'll be healthier, happier, and any resulting children will have a better life. I have been overweight for pregnancies and its not fun. I have been overweight for postpartum and baby/toddler years and it is much harder to work and play when overweight.
For anyone that is curious, I calculated her height by seeing what was a BMI of 30 @ 190 pounds. She is about 5'7. Using that height, I then used her current BMI of 41 to calculate her current weight.
She is about 260 pounds at 5'7
BMI 41 is hardly overweight! Stuff yourself even more, you deserve it! Have a cupcake and pizza 🙄
My BMI is 41Is the amount of weight loss she suggested necessary?
My BMI is 41
Is the amount of weight loss she suggested necessary?
If she's not lying about her BMI and weight reduction goal, then she's currently 5' 6" and 255 lbs...
Wtf is “anecdata”? Anecdotes are by definition NOT data.
Well I’ll be damned if “wonky” placenta isn’t a totally real medical term....
All this fighting just to not have to reduce the amount of gluttony that goes into your mouth.
Having a child while being obese gives major issues to the kid even if the pregnancy was okay! Almost definite childhood obesity with higher weight at lower age than their parents, more difficulties to lose the weight and higher overall mortality because of all of that.
I feel like if you need to lose190 lb/86kg just to get to 30 bmi maybe, just maybe the doctor is not trying to fatshame. I am 60 kg. This woman has my entire mass and then some of nothing but fat.
I had a BMI of 35 last time I was pregnant and it was absolute hell. I was eating a normal American diet and ended up with severe anemia. That caused me to be at high risk for an umbilical cord clot and have low amniotic fluid.
5'7", 250 lbs.
You have significantly higher risk of problems at this weight unless you're a champion bodybuilder. Get real.
"BMI should be 30" and she is complaining that this doctor is fat shaming?
Again, if you know so much more about health than the doctor, stop seeing them.
Yeah, she probably doesn't know how to use the big ol' grain of salt
The commenters use of statistics hurts me
How selfish. If she can't fathom losing some weight for the wellbeing of her nonexistent child, maybe it should stay nonexistent.
I'm almost more annoyed that she thinks I'm going to read all that.
I hope every doctor she meets turns her down after she asks for a more “weight neutral” opinion. It’s not ethical to ignore the obvious risks to protect their feelings.
Take medical advice from your doctor with a grain of salt?
Is a doctor, his or her job is to not let you die, not shaming you...
Isn't that not how probability works? I'm not great with probability and statistics but that doesn't seem right. Im also not pretending to have a better perspective than scientists in order to give out dangerous advice to vulnerable people on the interwebs.
Shouldn't newborn baby and maternal health statistics for the fattest and fittest US states be the same ?
New England, Hawaii, Minnesota, Colorado etc should have the same rates of death and illness as the Waffle House states.
Using anecdotal data to back up your claims is like saying "My Nan smoked a pack a day and she lived to be 100 so cigs are harmless!"
>fire the doctor
This is dumb. A lot of people have a hard time getting pregnant, or getting someone pregnant, and many of them can’t. I don’t understand why if you really wanted to bring a bundle of joy into the world, you wouldn’t pop out to Walmart for a food scale on your way back from the appointment.
What’s the BMI math on how fat this chick actually is?
11% risk of gestational diabetes is enough. Especially if you're incapable of restricting your diet, which you seem to be.
My wife was BMI 21 when she got GD with our first. To avoid major complications with her pregnancy, she was required to go on a very strict diet, monitor her blood sugar with pricks after every meal, and a host of other crap. She has awesome self-control and so gave birth to a healthy 8 pound baby.
At BMI 41, the lady in the OP does NOT have the self control to manage GD. Full stop. If she got GD, the list of possible complications is long, not the least of which is giving birth to a 12 pound baby that literally will not clear her pelvis.
None of this precludes her taking the risk and giving it a shot. But she asked her doctor and her doctor gave her an honest response.
I cannot imagine allowing medical reality to make me so angry. The facts are the facts. And increased risks are a thing, even if you know 100 fat women who had trouble free pregnancies. You are still at increased risk. You can either roll the dice, or choose to take simple steps to decrease your risk factors. Stop getting so emotional about it.
Why ask if you want a specific answer?
You don't fire doctors as a patient lmao
She is never going to find a “weight neutral” doctor, at least not a good one
Oh sweetie, it’s not just “technically” twice as likely.
I got pregnant at BMI 33. I had a miscarriage at 10 weeks. When I learned that obesity and miscarriage are correlated, I felt like I killed my baby. Maybe i did, maybe it would have happened anyway. 1 out of 5 pregnancies end in miscarriage. It’s a high risk. If you want a baby, why would you knowingly increase one of your risk factors? It’s not a small risk, it’s huge. And the guilt and regret on top of the pain of losing your baby are so much worse than any perceived fat shaming.
Do they mean water retention? Because otherwise there's nothing unrelated. Even with untreated hypothyroidism lowering the BMR it's still related to consumption.
I wonder what these “plenty of medical conditions and medicines” are that render calories completely irrelevant. Is there witchcraft involved? Holiday magic? The joyful laughter of leprechauns? Can someone get me a list of all these never-specifically-named condishuns and medicashuns?
Edit: Autocorrect fail.
Dear “Plenty of Medical Conditions”:
Can you please name just one that causes the mystery weight gain? One. That’s all I’m asking. I’d love to learn about the science behind it.
“Plenty of Medical Conditions” make you EAT MORE and some can make it harder to lose the weight but they don't create mass out of nowhere...
Where do these people get the idea that calories have nothing to do with weight management?
Is there some fountain of dietary inaccuracy from which they all drink every morning?
They probably mean non-fat weight gain, since no one can defy thermodynamics
Always the mysterious, unnamed ‘medical conditions.’
Side effects of medical conditions include increased appetite. Weight gain doesn’t magically happen.
Some, or a couple/few, is not the same as plenty. There are a few things that cause weight gain that isn't due to fat. Those few things are things that cause fluid retention. And if you have them, you should be under a doctor's care because most of them don't bode well for your long term health and well-being.
eating is a conscious, willful action. You can't 'uninentionally' consume food.
But you can unintentionally burn less or burn more. You have influence over your resting energy, but not total control.
Unpopular opinion: it's also bad FatLogic to forget that CICO has two variables: calories in and calories out.
Your CO can change on you even if you don't consciously change your activities. There is a wide variety of evidence that there are conditions that will cause weight to fluctuate without conscious effort, such as undiagnosed Type 1 diabetes , hypothyroidism , and hyperthyroidism .
Nor a fat advocate but my own weight rocketed after starting depression meds with out increasing my intake by much. My doctor also warned me about weight gain as a side-effect. The thermodynamics believer in me still can't make sense of this though!
An entirely novel renewable energy source, Nobel prize imminent?
But still they will judge healthy people or slim people, 'cause "society made them think being healthy is actually good".
I might have the unpopular opinion here, but I do think hormonal conditions can affect weight gain/loss
My mom struggled with severe hypothyroidism, but when they got her on levo the weight honestly fell right off with some dieting, while before it was just a stone wall
But that being said most people are full of shit and will lie, even to themselves, about having some sorta magical condition that makes them chonk. So I wouldn't beleive someone on the internet
I mean, they're half right - up to a certain point, several medical conditions will cause you to be unable to move, some can cause loss of inhibition control, over-eating, etc.
So you know, be kind.But it's.. not irrespective of calories.
Yeah it's called liver disease. I got from drinking so much my body shut down. I died well cold blue. Was in the ICU for a month then a 2 weeks the next month. Yeah it's not cool... if I over eat I throw up... I got food poisoning and the flu hit hard. All this happened this year. Well Dec 28. If i miss a meal i lose 2 lbs. It took me a 2 months to gain 4 lbs with the thanks of medical cannabis. Trip coming in and out and waking to see your whole family... because they didn't think I would make it. Fucker's tested my blood to find 39 thousand White blood cells. That's 4 times a healthy grown men. But I had enough blood left that on charts was a man getting shot 3 times and not found for an hour. Still made jokes with the nurses. All in all person as a point just viewing it in the wrong side.
What is a person eats while they sleep though? 🤔 There are medical conditions that make you do all sorts of stuff while you sleep, that's unintentional. There have been people who killed their spouses while sleeping even!
(I think I'm having too much fun coming up with exceptional scenarios lately)
But this is just me taking issue with the "eating is a conscious action" comment. If you watch Secret Eaters and the like you might notice that no, to a lot of people it really isn't.
Orrrrrrrr you're gaining weight. The lack of self-awareness here is really sad.
I can relate to the getting five pair of pants, all allegedly the same size, and having them fail to fit in five different ways. One will be too big in the waist, one will not pull up past my knees, one will be dragging on the floor because it's too long, another will fit everywhere except my hips, and the last one will be so baggy I could pass for an old Sierra protagonist with my whole inventory stuffed in there.
And the tags? All read the same.
Two options:1. Decide the manufacturer made smaller 16s, despite most stores making them ever larger.
When my regular size was suddenly too small, I realized I’d stretched my old ones out while I’d gotten fatter. After going through a few sizes, I finally decided maybe that should be my wake-up call. Too bad this person seems to have decided on option 1, denial.
I kind of feel sorry for her. I’ve been there. The denial stage is rough, and she seems to be coming to this realization pretty far into her weight gain.
I wish her the best of luck coming around to the reality of what’s probably actually going on, and then losing some weight before she truly starts struggling to find clothes. :-/
Oh man wait til she finds out the fit in sizes is actually getting bigger, not smaller!
I take it that she didn't consider that she was no longer a size 16
She says she can't even zip them up, then says they are "one inch" smaller around the waist. Huh? How tight was she wearing these jeans before that only one inch is the difference between "fits fine" and "can't zip?"
Sure, it’s not you at all. 🙄Meanwhile, every other clothing outlet in the world has expanded its clothes to vanity sizes to makes everyone feel good about themselves.
Who just orders 10 pairs of jeans, all in the same size?? Especially when they had sizing issues the last time they ordered?? I got one friggin' pair in my current size, and while I'd love to have one more, I really don't need more than that. And I love wearing jeans.
I'm not the best with judging sizes, how big of a difference is their between a 10 and a 16? She's already gone up that much and is now confused why she can't fit in 16 and might not fit in size 20?
psst “The 16s don’t fit because you outgrew them. Your old 16s aren’t bigger than the new ones, they’re stretched out because you wore them during your weight gain.”
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